Beauty Business Strategies
The podcast where salon, spa, medspa, barbershop, and lash studio owners — just like you — learn quick tips to make more money, inspire your team, and create world-class client experiences.
Beauty Business Strategies
Building a Salon/Spa Team with Shared Values and Individuality with Kelly Swann
On this episode, Kelly Swann joins the pod to share how she created a salon environment that's not just cutting-edge (Hello, Certified B Corporation!) but a nurturing ground for awesome company culture. Kelly's salon, Let Em Have It in Denver, CO has blended camaraderie with individual flair, earning them a spot among the prestigious Salon Today Top 200 for Culture in 2024.
Join the conversation to peel back the layers of Kelly's hiring strategy, which focuses on value alignment over pure skillset and the significance of a growth mindset in her Denver salon. Her commitment to fostering a "little slice of sunshine" has not only built an enjoyable work atmosphere but has also crafted a united team capable of weathering the pressures of the beauty business with grace.
Conversation highlights:
1:00 Defining "culture"
2:05 Aligning team on shared values
5:00 How to attract and hire talent with your core values
7:14 Balancing leadership and collaboration
10:19 Kelly's hiring process
15:58 Holding the team accountable to your culture
Watch the video version of this episode: https://youtu.be/ehgVK1ed8yo
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The Beauty Business Strategies Podcast is designed to give salon, spa, medspa, barbershop, and lash studio owners, just like you, quick tips to make more money, inspire your team, and create world-class client experiences.
Welcome to the Beauty Business Strategies Podcast. My name is Michael Yost and I'm joined today by Kelly Swan, owner of Let Em have it Salon. How are you, kelly?
Speaker 2:Good, how are you, Michael?
Speaker 1:I'm good, I'm good. So today we wanna talk about one of the favorite topics, which is culture. Again, the cool part about it is and we wanted to bring you a part of this podcast is because you're a Salon Today Top 200 winner this year. Congratulations in the area of culture. So well done. Is that your first Salon Today Top 200 win?
Speaker 2:Yes, as a business owner myself, I've worked for companies that have had it, but first as a big dog Awesome.
Speaker 1:Well, congratulations. So let's start with just the idea of culture. I think so many people have different concepts and different definitions about what culture means and even when we're listening, if I'm thinking to myself, I'm listening in on a podcast, I'm like, oh, another conversation on culture. Well, that's important to me. Let's define to you what's culture mean to you.
Speaker 2:For me, I would say the culture of a company is the energy of the team. Like what are the dynamics interpersonally, from team member to team member, from leadership to team? Is there a sense of camaraderie? Is there a sense of community? Is there individualism? Like what's the overall vibe?
Speaker 1:You bring up two words that really kind of trigger with me right now. What kind of I think the climate we're in you bring in this idea of camaraderie and individuality, and so I think a lot of times, especially from strategy standpoint, we talk a lot about team, we've got to be team and all of that. And yeah, I think some people take that as we got to do everything exactly the same way together. Or you know, my culture has got to be unified like that. How do you create camaraderie, build team but also and build that culture that you want but also have that camaraderie portion with the individuality portion? How's that? How's that mix for you?
Speaker 2:So for me, I would say that my company is a values-based company and it's making sure that we're all aligned with a similar set of values. So of course, we all have different personalities and quirks, like we are our own people. We don't have a set of clones, even though one of the girls on my team does say like, oh, we should just like clone ourselves and then we'll just multiply our team in that way. We don't want that. We like having like different perspectives and input, but if there's a shared set of values at the core of it, I think that's where the magic happens.
Speaker 1:Right. So how did you come up? I mean, when you talked about values, how did that develop in your business? You know number one just for reference how long has your business been open?
Speaker 2:My business has been open for since 2013. Ok, so almost 11 years, and I've been the owner for almost two years.
Speaker 1:OK, so you've been a part of this business, owned it now for the past couple of years. So, going back to the idea of values, so let's say someone new comes into your company, how do you share the values with them? And or, if your values evolved over the course of the time that you were there as a part of the team and then even when you took the lead as the owner of the business, how talk to me about that shift?
Speaker 2:just in general, yeah, so when I was a member of the team with the previous owner, um, she had a lot of values that were totally in alignment with me. Right, I joined that team because it was a values driven company. They were team based. Also one of three certified B corporations in the whole world out of salons, which is a huge deal. If you're not familiar with B corporation a salon, getting that is very hard because our industry is not the most sustainable or that's a different topic.
Speaker 2:I'm not going to go there but that's another podcast, but it'd be a fun one but it would and cause I think it would elevate our industry If more people looked into it. So there were already a number of things like her mission of sustainability and inclusivity and trying to make an impact on the industry is what made me want to join her team when I took over. Taking a look at the different core values while, yes, I do agree with all of them, I think most you know core values on paper. If you have a value sheet in front of you, you can pick, like, several things that land with you, right, I think, at our core, most people want to be a good person. You can pick several things that land with you. I think, at our core, most people want to be a good person.
Speaker 2:I took the time to really sit down and think about what are my values as a person and how do I want to run this company.
Speaker 2:And while she was doing a lot of things incredible, it was time for me to make it my own, and that is something that I've taken a lot of time over the last few years to really sit with and reflect. So, you know, putting it on our website, sharing it with our team. That's something that throughout the interview process. Before we even get on the phone with someone, we send a form, so just a job application, and all the questions that we send have nothing to do with skill. It's very much about who you are as a person and trying to find out like just based on those answers is this someone I want to continue a conversation with, or can I already tell we're probably not going to be on the same page. You know, and every step of the interview is around that, like just just seeing, like are we going to have like general things that are in alignment, like these super important core values? Because for me, I think that is the driving factor of my culture is when push comes to shove. We've all agreed to be in alignment on a few pretty big things.
Speaker 1:Gotcha, and I think it's interesting that you bring you know.
Speaker 1:I think sometimes people even talking about how you were just sharing, like I said, how you come up with your values. I think what's interesting about that is do we create values as a group and do it all together, or is it like, no, it's got to start with me? Yes, you know, and I think that is so crucial because I think most business owners I think this is a big disconnect really, and when we struggle with trying to get things done, trying to get things accomplished, I think the big disconnect is that, while we might establish values, sometimes they're even got to make sure they're ours. And you know, I think that's just a huge mistake that we often make is we set out some good value, like you said, we can look at a sheet and I can go cool, let's pick, you know, six or seven things off that I like and that fit and I or I want to be. But if it doesn't line up with you, you know, as the leader in the company or you as the base, you're going to have a hard time sustaining that.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Over the course of time.
Speaker 2:A hundred percent and I think that's one of the biggest lessons that I've gained, because when I first became the owner coming from a former team member and I just had the team dynamic as just a team among team members and stepping into ownership, I wanted it to all be so collaborative. I believe in team-based from the bottom of my heart and I'm learning some lessons along the way of. There are certain things as the business owner that I have to have the say on. I do have to have the connection to it and unfortunately, like you're not going to have, every person who joins your team isn't going to stay on your team. So if you're trying to create your values on a group of people, you don't know if that group of people is going to be with you every step of the way. Right, and that's a hard conversation to have, right. I want everyone to you know let's go and let's all grow and have this beautiful experience together and we're just going to keep growing together. But that's not life.
Speaker 2:No it's not real and that's not my experience either. Like the team I started with isn't the team I have.
Speaker 1:And I love that you brought that up because I think that's such a great point for us all to realize is that fact that I think we do think it's all going to be all like, oh, you know, kumbaya, hands holding around a campfire, that that's what team looks like and that's what it's always going to be. What team looks like and that's what it's always going to be. But yet, like you said, you know, having this means as a leader, I need to step up myself and keep moving this forward. It doesn't have to be. This isn't. Every decision is a decision by committee. Even if team is one of your core culture values, it's got to stay in the right perspective. It's got to stay in the right perspective.
Speaker 1:I want to jump back because I think something that we so often, at least that I feel like I hear as a coach, as an educator and things, and you mentioned it is so the hiring process is just this never ending like conversation. You know we're always looking how do I hire better? And things like that. You know you kind of mentioned out there. Like you know, let's start a little bit with what do you think attracts? And I think you've already kind of covered that. But you know just to maybe hit that a little bit more again what kind of attracts. But I'm also interested to know more about then when you get into your hiring process. You gave us kind of a brief drive by, but what are a few more of the specific things that look like Cause? I think that you know, I think that can be helpful to people that are listening or things like that is to go like all right well wonder what Kelly really does.
Speaker 1:What does she do? Like she said, she does a couple of interviews and it looks like but what does that look like? So like what's your like initially, but more so than even when you get to that interview process. A little bit more depth on that, because I think that can be helpful for the listener, I think, first of all, ever evolving.
Speaker 2:I joke with my team I'm like this is all one big experiment, right? We're looking for something that's going to be awesome, that we're so proud of and in a lot of ways we are and it's always evolving. And where it stands right now is we have an add-on, indeed, for example, so someone reaches out through that, we send them a link to our waiver. Please fill this form out. If the form, you know, sparks a sense of curiosity, you know we we were originally kind of like nope, not it. But now it's like do I want to get to know this person further? That's what we're looking for in our interviews like, do I want to continue this conversation with you or do I feel like we've kind of come to a screeching halt? So when we read those answers it's like okay, they're talking about like kind of similar values and all of that and a growth mindset. That's huge for us.
Speaker 2:Then we have a phone interview and in the initial phone interview our manager will talk to them and tell them all the ways that we operate, different from a lot of other salons, and talk about our team-based structure, talk about our expectations, talk about the behaviors that we've agreed upon and every step of the way in the interview process, like it's a combination of like getting to know the applicants and then also telling them about who we are, how we show up and what we expect of each other, because I deeply believe in having mutually beneficial relationships. So if it's just like, oh, tell me all about you and tell me this and how about that, it's like well, no, you also need to find out do you like this environment? You know what I mean. Like we're in Denver, colorado.
Speaker 2:We're super low key, like casual I wear this to work, like I'm not in all black, like you know, and we have like a very like chill and loving vibe in our salon. So someone who wants to blast techno and party and go out, you're probably not going to enjoy just our little low-key vibe that we have. You know what I mean. Does that make sense? Really, trying to have it be like I want you to get to know us too. You find out if you want to be here, right, I've always said, an interview is exactly that.
Speaker 1:An interview is a two-way street. Yeah, this is. You know, this is one of those things that it's like, yes, I'm finding out more about you, but the interview should also be you finding out about us. You know, because do we fit what you're looking for? And you know because do we fit what you're looking for? And I think it's really important to acknowledge, and even you probably, because I think a lot of times most people that go in for interviews don't go in with that mindset.
Speaker 1:So, even trying to create maybe some opportunities that you know, giving them some guidance as to hey listen, prompting them maybe even a little bit to be like so what do you want to know about us that's important to you? Yeah, because if not, we're going to end up possibly like you said, hey listen, if this is your style and this is the kind of music you like and this is the kind of way you you like to you know kind of your lifestyle. You know we may or may not be the right fit yeah, you might not enjoy it right doesn't make one right or wrong.
Speaker 1:Just means that yeah, it's just not this doesn't the culture doesn't match.
Speaker 2:Like, yeah, is it something that? So, ultimately, the reason culture is so important to me is salon owners will get this. Taking on the responsibility of owning a business is so hard yeah, I did not know how hard it was before I decided to do it.
Speaker 1:No one does Cause if they did, no one would ever do it. No one would do it. No, no one would do it.
Speaker 2:But now that I'm in it, I'm like I have a fierce determination to win. But ultimately I want it to be a place that I want to be and that I enjoy and I really value fun and having a lively and fun environment, like just a loving atmosphere where everyone's like wants to be there. Right, if anyone's just showing up and just like whatever, I can't handle it. I just can't handle it because I have so much stress on me on any given day that I always say I want this salon to be our little slice of sunshine. And day that I always say I want this salon to be our little slice of sunshine, like when I walk in I want to feel sunshine, I want our team to feel sunshine, I want our clients to feel sunshine.
Speaker 2:And at Strategies you guys talk a lot about what we sell is time and retail, and with our time, we're also selling vibes. So it all starts from within, right, and that's a big part of like understanding people. While we're hiring, like hey, let's be so serious and like let's get, like tell me a hundred percent, like don't tell me what you think I want to hear. And I say this to people I'm like I don't care what you think. I want to hear, I want to know the truth, because, ultimately, we want to build long lasting employer employee relationships, and that comes from you know. This is how we are. Does that inspire you, or is that going to feel like an obligation to you? You know, yeah, yeah, so with the vibes, it's like our clients always tell us that they love the way that they feel in the salon, and that's not quantifiable. It's not something that's tangible, right, but I do think it's something that starts from within. So I'm not.
Speaker 2:So everything starts from me. Am I taking care of myself? Am I attending to my own mental, physical, emotional health needs? Am I consistently trying to grow? Am I learning from my mistakes? And then, am I holding my team to the same standards that they've agreed to? So that's the other thing is like. Throughout the hiring process, we talk about all of these different things that we expect, and during the onboarding process, we go through a list of behaviors that the team has all agreed upon. Essentially, it's the broadband, and we view that as our code of conduct, and during onboarding we go through line by line. Do you agree to show up on time? Do you agree to have a positive and supportive attitude. Do you agree to try to seek to mentor others? Do you agree to keep a growth mindset? And, one by one, do you agree to this? And everyone says yes, of course, of course, of course.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Of course, and we're all human, so sometimes we violate those agreements. And that's what also comes back to me. Am I going to hold myself and the rest of the team, who's agreed to these behaviors, to those standards? And it's I don't know. I've been thinking about this a lot Like I think having a strong and thriving team culture takes a lot of courage. Now, from different experiences, I've had.
Speaker 1:Well, I was going to say you mentioned the word courage because I was going to say and what you're sharing is that's got to lead to a lot of what we'll classify as difficult conversations. But I want to frame that the right way, because a difficult conversation doesn't have to. You know, I think sometimes our mind immediately goes to I've got to bear down and I've got to tell you something, and that I've got to have this conversation Difficult. Really, I think the way you just framed it up is hey, listen, you know, I know you've got the right heart, I know you want to do the right thing, we're coming from the right mindset to things like that. It's simply difficult because I have to maybe have a conversation that just is naturally not easy for me to have or has a lot of feeling or emotion or depth to it. That's the difficult part, you know, not so much that I gotta difficult you know like on the hammer exactly it's not that.
Speaker 1:So with that, you know, when you get into those moments of it's like, hey, you know what, we've kind of crossed the line or we've kind of as, as you said, we're all human Like, do we agree to these things? Yes, but then sometimes we violate those agreements, what do you find is the best way that you like to approach those conversations?
Speaker 2:Quickly. First and foremost, don't let it fester.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And like just always with kindness and respect at the forefront, right, um, but those conversations are so much easier now that we've started operating as agreements, because it used to be like, oh god, like so-and-so's, not doing what they said they were gonna do. And oh god, I'm the boss now and I have to say it like, oh God, everyone else is mad. But like only telling me and, oh God, and it's scary, because you never want to hurt anyone's feelings, right, right, I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, I want to have fun. All the time, that's all I want to do is just laugh and play. And so when something happens, that is not fun and you have to have a hard conversation, I'm like, oh God, I don't want you to be mad at me. And now this, like I'm not laughing about this because I'm actually pretty pissed, like, oh, that was so much harder and going through an onboarding and having every single person on the team agree to different behaviors, it's so much easier.
Speaker 2:We also say in that initial feedback or job application how do you best give and receive feedback? So it's just like we've all agreed that we would just like to have a direct conversation. And then it's just hey, can we chat? Let's go through this. This is what happened. This is the behavior that it's going against. You agreed to show up in this way, but this is what you've done. Let's talk about it. And most people want to move forward and want to try to make things right, and we also have a 90-day probation period with employment, so that's something I'm kind of like leaning into is like yes, I want this fun and loving atmosphere and we have a business to run right. Yes, we've become friends along the way and the reason we know each other is because we work together and someone has to adhere to the systems right, and actually we all do.
Speaker 2:We're going to be here and so you know when people are trying to move forward. It's's like yeah, absolutely, I will help you, I will try to coach you. But what we've decided is, in the first 90 days, if there's more than three violations of the agreements, we are going to just chalk it up as potentially this isn't the right fit, because if early on in that relationship there's already violations happening, as people get more comfortable, that's probably going to show up a little bit more, which sucks.
Speaker 1:Yep, it does.
Speaker 2:Sucks. But it's that idea of like, if I make an exception for you, I have to make it for everyone, and then is that even a value.
Speaker 1:we have and you know what, and that goes against for you, that violates the agreement that you agreed to. Yeah, you know, I mean it's a full circle thing. It's like, hey, listen, if I want you to be accountable and dependable and, you know, follow the agreements that you're mapping out, I'm sure a lot of those fall back right to you in that same way. Because you're mapping out, I'm sure a lot of those fall back right to you in that same way. Because you're not doing that, you're violating the agreement. And then you got to have a talk with yourself about it and that's not a good thing.
Speaker 1:I tell you what I'm going to kind of wrap up here, because this is the perfect place for us, because I think we've got so much out of today. Kelly, what you shared, just kind of recapping my brain, a couple of key things that stood out to me was the fact that you know, first and foremost, we've got to establish ourselves with the values piece it's just so essential and those values have to be yours, have to live with you, not just a created, manufactured kind of a thing, not just a checklist.
Speaker 2:Exactly this is inside who I am, how I operate. Yep.
Speaker 1:Those got to bleed throughout everything you do. The second thing is I loved how you address the fact that you know I love it. We sat down out of those values. Then we start talking about the agreements that we make to ourselves and to the company and how that works and if, when those things are violated and they will be cause we are human, that we address those quickly. And then you said that right out of the gate, quickly and that is so important, but then with, like, the right attitude, the right mind, the right mindset, that kindness and clarity and everything you talked about so perfect. You did a great job. Thank you so much, kelly. This is so good today, you know talking to you, so I appreciate it and, for all of you out there, thanks for joining us and we look forward to seeing you again on our next Beauty Business Strategies podcast.
Speaker 3:Thanks again for listening to the Beauty Business Strategies podcast. If you liked this episode, be sure to hit follow To learn more about how strategies can help create more fun, profit and growth potential for you, your company and your team. We invite you to schedule a free 60 minute strategy session by clicking the direct link in the description of this episode.